Michelle Pualani: [00:00:00] being thoughtful about, okay, if I am going to take a stand, if I do have something to say about this, if it aligns with my core values and my mission, my brand, how I'm showing up, then I can take a stand that is reflective of that.
Michelle Pualani: Compassion, integrity, humanitarianism, as opposed to political alignment and being thoughtful about that.
Joanna Newton: this also is where actual connection and community with your audience also really, really helps. This is something that we've talked about on this podcast before, right? Showing up authentically to your audience, showing who you really are, sharing your life because a couple of things will happen.
[00:01:00]
Michelle Pualani: Welcome back to the Her First Podcast. Today we have a very controversial topic. We are chatting about what just took place in regards to, if you've heard any of the following recently, Haley Bailey. Met Gala, Gaza, All Eyes on Rafah, Free Palestine. And what to do about the celebrity blackout and how you're showing up in your business, in your online content creation, and thinking [00:02:00] strategically about what it is that you're saying on your platform.
Michelle Pualani: Um, when. World issues, social injustices, things of this nature come to the forefront and take over social media. I don't know about you, but my entire feed last week, my For You page, was taken over by these narratives and these conversations. And it makes us question and makes us wonder, how do we engage with them?
Michelle Pualani: What do we do? How do we invest our time and attention? Should I be talking about this on my platform? Should I be addressing this in my business? Should I be feeding into this? What do I believe? What do I think? Where am I supposed to be placing my focus or my belief system? And we're not obviously here to tell you how or what to do with any of that.
Michelle Pualani: This is a commentary and a narrative on some of our perspectives. Joanne and I may have different perspectives on this as well, but it's each of us kind of [00:03:00] bringing things to think about. Um, bringing some thoughts to the conversation and ways that you can start to think about not just this, because we will continue to encounter other social issues.
Michelle Pualani: We are moving into, I think, what has been the most challenging political climate to navigate because of the advent of the internet. And social media, whereas we've always dealt with issues similar to this in the past. They just haven't been blasted and reached that virality level where everyone's talking about them, engaging with them, and discussing them on an international level in such a dramatic and invested kind of way.
Michelle Pualani: So we're going to share some resources today. We're going to talk about how to tactically approach this situation as a coach, as a content creator, as a business owner in the online space who probably leverages social media and who has some kind of platform in which you're [00:04:00] getting in front of people.
Michelle Pualani: How do you do that? How do you navigate that while also being thoughtful, kind, compassionate, and Aware of what's happening in the world and not. Um, acting as tone deaf, perhaps, as certain recent circumstances have brought to light. So I'm going to give you a little bit of background on what has happened.
Michelle Pualani: Um, but first I'm going to have Joanna chime in just to kind of kick us off today.
Joanna Newton: I find this situation so interesting, and if you've been watching along, I'd imagine you are. And for me, whenever I see this, like, kind of social phenomenon happening and, like, groupthink all going in one direction, I, My brain always goes in two directions. As a marketer, as someone who coaches, coaches and creators, as someone who creates social strategies, I think about what's happening from a strategic standpoint, right?
Joanna Newton: Like I, my [00:05:00] brain goes there and I think about what strategies are happening, how people are responding, how kind of the group of people on, like the people on TikTok are responding, how the celebrities, like. I watch it from like a case study perspective while I'm going through it because I am a marketer.
Joanna Newton: I am a coach. But then I also watch it from a humanitarian perspective, right? Like, because I'm someone who cares a lot about a lot of different like social justice issues. Like, I care about the loss of life like deeply. Like, there's also that piece in my heart that's going on. So, Things like this happen all of the time, you know, this is not the first time we've seen a wave like this of people who are saying celebrities need to speak up about this issue and if they don't, they're getting canceled.
Joanna Newton: Think about, um, you know, the Black Lives Matter movement, right? Things happen that there's this, like, wave of expectation [00:06:00] of answers from celebrities and, you know, It's always really interesting to watch from both perspectives. One is someone who cares about issues, um, and, and wants to see social justice and social change. But then also as a marketer, like watching how people are navigating it from that kind of more like scientific standpoint.
Michelle Pualani: And I think we really should have both. And as a business owner, we actually need to think critically about both. I can watch this from a neutral perspective and say, you know, that phrase that all publicity is good publicity. And for Haley Bailey, although this may be a chink in the situation of her career and her celebrity ship, if that's a word, Ultimately, from a sales and psychological and engagement perspective, this is also going to grow her platform over time.
Michelle Pualani: And we have yet to see the impact of that. But we have walked ourselves into what you call this [00:07:00] cancel culture, which can be so interesting and almost like a. Addictive to watch, like I don't know about you, but I just got stuck in the scroll of paying attention to watching this video and watching this feedback and watching this person comment on it.
Michelle Pualani: And there's some really thoughtful responses. There are also some really uneducated responses and there are some very heated and passionate experiences from this. And I kind of have that same perspective of looking at this from a strategic platform and seeing it in this way or seeing the impact of it, seeing the reach, seeing the engagement, Transformation of what took place and the virality of that.
Michelle Pualani: And I'll explain that a little bit if you're not quite sure what we're talking about. But also the humanitarian aspect of it. And as someone who comes from lots of non profit work, lots of work in, you know, women's rights and sexual assault and supporting women in their right to ownership of their body and food justice and thinking about the climate.
Michelle Pualani: Like, [00:08:00] I spent a lot of time in that space for quite some time, so things like this really do rile me up. And just before we started recording, Joanne and I are getting excited and I can feel the passion and it's palpable. And I hope that you feel that too, and I hope that you have some emotion around what is happening because with emotion comes change, comes action, comes our ability to step up and say something or do something different.
Michelle Pualani: And I do want to preface because I'm going to share some things that you might not agree with and that might be a little controversial for you listening. But just remember that we each have our own choice of how we engage in this, and that's going to be kind of at the forefront of this conversation and deciding how you're going to engage is very important.
Michelle Pualani: Deciding, you know, where you place your attention, where you invest your time, what you energetically care about, how you use passion, emotion to do something, you [00:09:00] know, to move something forward, to make a piece of content, to create a product, to develop a program, or to impact and initiate change in our world because we need more of it.
Michelle Pualani: more of that. So don't just get upset and let it fizzle out or don't just get upset and criticize or complain. Think about how you can leverage that, how you can use that to actually do something different. So I'm going to give you a little bit of background on what happened. What we do highly advise you do is just your own research.
Michelle Pualani: Look it up. Learn more about it. Read the things, watch the stuff, don't take our word for it, just get in there because I'm just going to give you a high level overview of what happened and you can decide how much again you want to learn about it, figure out kind of what's happening in the world. In your own time.
Michelle Pualani: So what happened? So the Met Gala. The Met Gala is a fundraiser that's hosted annually, by the Costume Institute. And that was an [00:10:00] agreement that they pay for their own presence as an organization within the Metropolitan Museum of Arts. And that is the Costume Institute. It's in Manhattan. Um, it's been hosted every year.
Michelle Pualani: paused for time during COVID, but ultimately it's a fundraiser to generate money for a program that supports fashion. So the entire event is staged around fashion. That's going to be important because it comes into our conversation later on in understanding why this event is what it is and how I think there's a lot of displaced attention and focus because of this event.
Michelle Pualani: Haley Bailey is a celebrity at this point. She has around 10 million followers, I think over 30 million across platforms. She has hosted some Super Bowl stuff. She's been at award ceremonies. She creates funny videos online. She connects and has always been really relatable for a lot of people, um, and those who follow [00:11:00] her.
Michelle Pualani: Um, she posted a video of her outfit in a dress, beautiful dress, um, and beautiful look that used the trending sound, let them eat cake from the Kirsten Dunst version of Marie Antoinette. And on the same day civilians in Rafah were being murdered.
Michelle Pualani: So, the timing of the video, the timing of the post was Not positive. It was not well received. And Stitches and everything that started happening as a result of that, everything in the comments, really just attacking Haley about her post and what she had put out into the world, being incredibly tone deaf, being very opulent, participating in the Met Gala when there essentially is genocide and the killing of women and children and civilians in Palestine, so that is essentially the background. Again, look up the details. I am not an expert on this. I always have to ask and defer to my husband, who is much more in tune with [00:12:00] happening in politics, but that is what created this conversation.
Michelle Pualani: And so now it's gone on to be the celebrity blackout. And we're looking at everyone who attended the Met Gala and basically saying, you need to speak up about the genocide that's happening. You need to speak up about these social injustices that are happening in the world right now and presently. Use your platform for good.
Michelle Pualani: Do something about it. So that's kind of where we stand. We are Giving celebrities a hard time for their platform and wanting them to speak out and have a political say in what's happening and using their platform for what we think they should be using it for, and basically asking of them to take a stand or take initiative
Michelle Pualani: to speak out against the atrocities that are happening at this time.
Joanna Newton: you know, it's so fascinating to watch if we look at that, you know, thinking as as a marketer, like what happened? What went down? How did it all go down? [00:13:00] Like it makes me think about yes, like what she did was incredibly tone deaf. Right? And it sparked a lot of passion online. And for some reason, we in the United States look to celebrities to be the ones to, like, pioneer these social issues. And Maybe they should, or maybe they shouldn't. I think for them, that is a personal decision. What they want to talk about on their platform and what they want to do. And later in this episode, we're going to talk about, like, what we recommend people and personal brands do when thinking about talking about, about issues. But it is incredibly tone deaf. And I think watching all of this happens, one, makes me think as a celebrity, like, Um, most celebrities have a, have a PR person, someone that is working with them to make sure they [00:14:00] kind of understand what's going on, that they're not being tone deaf, that they're responding to things properly, right? There is this bizarre dichotomy that's happening right now between the uber wealthy and, and The working class and the poor, even if we just take the United States, you know, forget about the outside world for a second and just think about the United States. We do have people attending these lavish, lavish events.
Joanna Newton: And then we do have others who literally can't afford groceries. Like the price of groceries are just insane. And there's something going on right now that is not okay. Um, and I think people wanting to do something about it is very, very natural, right? People want to, to actually do something. But the question is, is this attention really in a, in a place that's going to do something?
Joanna Newton: Is blocking [00:15:00] all of the celebrities going to make genocide in, in, in Gaza stop? Like, is that what's gonna be the thing? Maybe. I'm not, like, a expert in this area. I don't think so. I think that energy could likely be used somewhere else. We could support the celebrities that are speaking out, right? That's a little bit different than blocking the ones who are not, right?
Joanna Newton: Let's, let's elevate those people who are talking about it versus alienating those that are not. Because Right now in the social media world, attention is currency, right? Like if you have people's attention, you get brand deals. If you have people's attention, you get new movies. If you have people's attention, you get all the things that you want. So we as consumers, if we're thinking of with our consumer hat on, should be giving attention to the places that we feel strongly about.
Michelle Pualani: I [00:16:00] couldn't agree more. I think that that'll come out multiple times throughout this conversation. And as you're listening, thinking about how you're participating in this. And how we all are collectively. As consumers, as business owners, as people who have Phones in our hands and are engaging on social media.
Michelle Pualani: There's a lot to be said about the power that we wield in that way. There's a couple of things is that when it comes to celebrities, I think it's a totally displaced, piece of power that we're giving them. Yes, they have attention. Yes, they have focus. And you're totally right. Attention is currency. That's where the money goes.
Michelle Pualani: All of the money in the world is so much invested in marketing. Like, realistically, that's where so much it is. of it is, and this event is actually a marketing event for brands, so that's a whole other discussion. I think it's interesting because we have this huge disparity and wealth gap, but here we are commenting on celebrities when someone like Hayley Bailey, I have not looked up her net worth, but I can tell you it's [00:17:00] actually technically probably not even that much because she is a celebrity.
Michelle Pualani: Shouldn't even be considered in my mind in the same category as someone who is an impactful celebrity that has a platform when it comes to fame via TV, movie, artistry, Zendaya, Tom Holland, Oprah, Those are people who have a very different amount of wealth. Like, I know that Haley's apology video really struck the wrong chord with a lot of people.
Michelle Pualani: I get it, and I know that people are like commenting on how much her apartment is every single month and all these things, but she is not compensated in the same way as movie stars and celebrities. Like, she's still working off of brand deals, and we know that follower count does not equal people. Wealth conversion sales.
Michelle Pualani: She doesn't even sell any of her products or programs. Like she is not probably even leveraging her platform to the extent that she could, if we're talking about monetization, because [00:18:00] she's focused on a different avenue. She is an influencer. And so it's very different. And so she is supported by brands and a lot of brands also dictate what it is that certain people can and cannot say.
Michelle Pualani: So I think that she's more. Barred in that way, um, and a lot of celebrities, like in my opinion, the reason that they are celebrities and the reason that they have our attention and focus in the first place is because they've made us laugh. They've made us cry. They've made us smile. They have made us feel something through the work that they do.
Michelle Pualani: do which is typically in the entertainment category. And that, in my opinion, is their role. That is their lane. I don't necessarily trust someone that I listen to their music of to tell me political action or interest or where I should be focusing my attention. And I understand that they have a platform.
Michelle Pualani: And they can decide how they want to wield it. And if people are speaking up and saying that they want to see a certain thing, I get why people feel that way. But I [00:19:00] don't think that they're qualified to talk about those things. We're going to talk about this from a tactical perspective, but there's a difference between speaking out politically and a difference of compassion and humanitarianism.
Michelle Pualani: So. They can take a stand for people and the issue when it comes to the social injustice that is happening and use their platform in that way if that is what they choose to do. And I think it's okay to demand it and want to see it, but just keep in mind that you are focusing your attention in the wrong direction.
Michelle Pualani: We'll talk about this with the Met Gala and what the Met Gala actually does, but it generated 26 million. Now for a lot of people, That's quote unquote a lot of money, but that is what the Costume Institute runs off of. Okay, that supports jobs. It supports the actual like fashion. It supports the exhibits.
Michelle Pualani: It supports a lot of things. Take the CEO of Chase. Make 75 million a year, if not more by this [00:20:00] point. Your attention, your interest, and who you're pressuring is displaced. and that is why I believe that celebrities, to a certain extent, can stay in their lane, and that we should, instead, shift and position our focus to the places that matter, because if we're talking about wealth disparity, It's not in an organization's ability to generate income for their efforts supporting the staff, the team, the economy that they create.
Michelle Pualani: It's about the individuals like Jeff Bezos, Apple CEO, like all of these people at a very high level that are pocketing the money. Using it personally and then also you are supporting by facilitating what it is that you're doing about and getting upset about this is a total tangent and Joanna, I'm going to pass it back to you in a second.
Michelle Pualani: But if you are sitting on TikTok commenting on your freaking iPhone, you are invested in a multi billion dollar [00:21:00] industry that is servicing the wealthy. The Met Gala should not be getting the flack that it has and does because of this. Yes, it's opulent. Yes, it's over the top, but it's designed that way because people will watch it and therefore invest their time and attention and therefore get the marketing channels and all of the brands and all of the businesses that are putting that money out, not the celebrities themselves, but are putting that money out because we are paying attention to it and that's what we want to watch.
Michelle Pualani: so much. So, think about that.
Joanna Newton: Michelle, I love you all fired up. Like, I've never like seen you this passionate and it's fantastic. And I have a couple of thoughts on the, on the things, all the things you just said. First, thinking about celebrities, right? How many times when celebrities win an award. And they get on stage and they choose to use their award [00:22:00] speech to say something political. They might speak out against the war in Palestine. They might talk about, um, you know, LGBTQ issues. They might speak out against abortion. And when they do those things, they are criticized. And people respond with things like shut up and sing, or you should just play basketball, or whatever that is. So when celebrities do speak out, they're criticized.
Joanna Newton: And when they don't speak out, they're criticized. And right, you could say like, oh boo hoo, they have all of this money, like, Fair, right? Like, like, let's look at the problems, but they are in a tough position. Eyes are on them. If they talk politically, they're, they're going to be looked at one way. And if they don't, they're looked at another.
Joanna Newton: So just keep that in mind. Like they're in these positions where they. Are kind of damned if they do damned if they don't and um, [00:23:00] this is why when we start getting tactical for actual coaches and brands, this is why really understanding your brand mission, your personal stance is so important because as a creator and as someone who has a public platform, even if it's small compared to a celebrity, it's your choice what you talk about and you have to know what's important to you and what you feel strongly about to make these decisions for you.
Joanna Newton: for yourself as a, as a creator. But these celebrities are just in a really, really tough position. And then you look at, right, these billionaire business moguls, no one's really criticizing them, no one's really picking on them, we're feeding Amazon, we're feeding Apple, we're feeding all of these corporations with all of this money that they get. They're not taking a stand, right? They could use their money to enact change. They're not doing that, right? And one of the things [00:24:00] that, you know, I, I talk on my social account a lot about like issues that women face in the workplace and, and ways that we aren't, aren't treated properly. And one of the things that, that people, a couple of things people will come back at me is they'll say like, Well, Jeff Bezos would have never gotten to where he is if he isn't cutthroat, so you have to be cutthroat to be a leader and you need to be this, like, very specific way to be a leader. And I'm like, I'm saying that's wrong. We, we need a different world where our business leaders are thinking about the effect of what they do on humanity. Like, Jeff Bezos should be considering the things that he's doing and how it is hurting or helping. Because he actually, he actually has power to change things. How he pays people. what he charges, right? [00:25:00] That the, the working conditions where he puts his profits, those could make huge changes, um, in our economy where like Haley Bailey, like, okay. Like, I would love it, that'd be great if she spoke out about issues. Don't get me wrong. If she wants to speak out and take a stand, I'm here for it, right?
Joanna Newton: I am totally here for it. More power to her, give her that. But can she make the impact that our, our big CEO business owners and our political leaders can make.
Michelle Pualani: Absolutely 100%. And I think that, again, it's more of a matter of displaced attention, and we're attracted to and pulled into the fame, the celebrity life. Like, I know that there's an obsession there, right? It's like the kind of reality television show, the documentaries, like seeing behind the scenes. And I hear what you're saying when [00:26:00] people have that sense of like, oh, poor them.
Michelle Pualani: They're so wealthy. I'm like, Yeah. Money doesn't fix everything. These are still people. There's still people at the heart of it. And whether you have 10, 000, whether you have a million dollars, whether you have multi billions of dollars, like, you're still a person. And I think that with celebrity and fame, There's a lot of mental health components that come along with it.
Michelle Pualani: You are completely and constantly in the public eye. So you have to be aware of what you're wearing, what you're saying, how you're being in any situation, because you're going to get criticism. And I know that they sign up for that. Not obviously, because they want it, but because that's part of the job.
Michelle Pualani: That's part of the job description. You get that, unfortunately, because we have a world of 8 billion people who all think that their opinions matter so, so much, me included. Obviously we're walking around as egocentric human beings that our opinions matter and we feel like we need to change, affect, [00:27:00] sway people to believe or see the way that we do.
Michelle Pualani: And Unfortunately, celebrities and those who are in that quote unquote famous category take a lot of that flack. I see Hayley as just like a working girl, like truthfully, and everyone's like, oh, you're going to award shows and you're doing these things. It's like, yeah, she might live a slightly elevated lifestyle in terms of the fashion, in terms of what she's doing with her time, but like, We all gotta work for it.
Michelle Pualani: Like, she's putting in the time. She's doing the videos. She's showing up. She's, you know, compromising on, I'm sure, her, what, like, time invested in other things, potentially her health in certain ways. She is making that shit happen, and I'm not gonna give her flack or a hard time for doing that. Maybe if that was a situation in which I knew this person, it would, like, be pull aside and be like, Hey, we probably should have thought about like how we engaged in that or do something different, but she's not a bad person.[00:28:00]
Michelle Pualani: And I think we get so hung up on again this cancel culture identity of wanting to just tear people down. And it doesn't matter how much you supported them up to a certain point. If they do one thing wrong, it's like you just strip the humanness of that person, you take it away and you just start to attack them.
Michelle Pualani: And I don't know why we have this nature in us, but I think it's just a thing that we need to be more aware of as consumers and as social media grows because we're just feeding into it. And again, where are you placing your time and attention? If you put as much. focus on changing the narrative for the platform that you're on.
Michelle Pualani: Instagram, TikTok, YouTube. So much money. I can tell you 26 million for the, you know, year budget for this institute. Pales [00:29:00] in comparison to on a moment to moment basis, day by day, what is being spent on Amazon in the digital space with ad buying and how much these brands and businesses are making. So just changing where you're focusing your attention, who you're asking to call to action.
Michelle Pualani: And yes, we have government leaders who are literally responsible for this. Like this is their job, holding them accountable. In my opinion, I think going to affect so much change. And there are celebrities who do choose to wield their power in certain ways, use their influence and speak out. I know that Angelina Jolie, Cate Blanchett, Emma Watson. So there are lots of folks who didn't. do that. And like Joanna's saying is like elevate them, pay attention to them, not so much slander, blackout, like you're focusing all of your attention on the negative and that [00:30:00] money is going to follow where your attention goes.
Michelle Pualani: So as much as it is negative, it's still going to go to those places. So really pay attention, really tune into that, and think a little bit more critically as a consumer how we're engaging in that and how we're going to affect change.
Joanna Newton: and right, like focusing on the people that you align with. is going to do, do a bigger impact, right? Nobody's right now talking about the celebrities that are doing good things. We're talking about the celebrities that we don't like. We are giving them attention. Whereas if we instead were saying, let's all go, instead of like blocking people, let's go all follow and comment. On so and so's last post, where she was speaking out against what's happening. And what's so tough too, is there are There are a lot of issues with our world. And I, you know, I admit that sometimes [00:31:00] I live in a bubble because I'm like sitting working with creators all day, doing positive things in the world, doing all of these things. But there are so many issues. Like, if you started to try to address every single world issue, you're going to exhaust yourself. And I think this comes back to, I think we, as humans, as individuals, we have to decide where we want to put our attention. Like one example, you know, we're talking about Gaza and, and the effect it's having especially on women and children and civilians. But I don't know if you knew this, Michelle. The majority of the chocolate we eat comes from child slave labor, so if you started saying, I'm not going to use any product that uses slave labor, you're going to have no choice. an immensely difficult time even finding products to purchase that [00:32:00] don't utilize slave labor. if we banned imports, you know, I'm not, I'm not really actually, I don't know enough to call for that, but what I'm saying is, if I, If you banned companies from working with people that use slave labor, then we couldn't get products that HA had slave labor to begin with, right?
Joanna Newton: Because if you were to go down a rabbit hole of that, you'd have a really hard time finding anything you could buy.
Michelle Pualani: Yeah, there are social injustices everywhere. And when you start actually looking at the structure of economy, business, transactions, marketing, all of those things, you start to learn about food injustice, you're looking at social inequities, you're looking at wealth disparity, like there's a ton of shit.
Michelle Pualani: And you know what? also brings this thought up is that Russia is still in Ukraine. So what happens socially is that everyone gets on the bandwagon to support something. And I'm not [00:33:00] saying that supporting that thing is wrong because it is important and people are dying. And, um, Locations are being affected and places being bombed and buildings being broken down and things being burned and starvation happening like that is very real.
Michelle Pualani: And I think people should take that seriously and treat it seriously. That being said, what happens at a social level, and we're looking at responding to this, is that people jump on the bandwagon and they support it. And then they don't have really the ability to keep up with it because they're focused on their daily lives.
Michelle Pualani: Day by day, making ends meet, paycheck to paycheck, like working, getting involved. They turn to entertainment, they turn to social media, they turn to the distractions, sports, news, et cetera, to kind of get away and they avoid. And then, okay, here comes the next thing. Social injustice. Oh. Gosh, this is happening.
Michelle Pualani: Someone's invading this war is happening. People are being taken advantage of people are being killed. Let's jump on that bandwagon. We need to pay attention [00:34:00] to this. And then their attention fizzles out and this is happening consistently. It's like over the course of just the past few years, we look at BLM.
Michelle Pualani: We look at Ukraine. We look at what was happening in Africa, which the details are jumping out of my mind right now. And then we look at the situation in Gaza, and it's difficult because we do live in a very challenging world, and this platform is not for us. The place to stand up on a pedestal necessarily, and to talk about that.
Michelle Pualani: But I do think that we each for ourselves have to critically look at what is happening in the world. How can I stay informed and updated to the point that is safe for my own mental health and awareness? Because at a certain point they did this study with the Boston Marathon that I thought was really interesting.
Michelle Pualani: Is that those watching the Boston Marathon happening through their televisions? through [00:35:00] news, through social media, we're actually more traumatized and affected than people who experienced it in person. And you want to know why? It's because people who are watching it from afar felt hopeless. They were seeing it, but they couldn't do anything about it.
Michelle Pualani: So it negatively impacted them, and they experienced more symptoms of PTSD or stress as a response to that. So when we watch these things that are happening in the world, yes, we have to stay informed, but we also have to protect our own mental health and well being. Because these things are going to continue to happen unless you want to take a seat in government.
Michelle Pualani: Unless you want to join the UN. Unless you actually want to be with Doctors Without Borders and take action. Or be a journalist and go report on these things. And that Is an inspired choice of alignment for certain people in our world. Some of us are not called to those things and that's okay. So again, I think it's okay for us to kind of decide where we stay in our lane and then decide how we want to [00:36:00] engage.
Michelle Pualani: So I think now it's an important time for us to talk about tactically as a business owner, as a coach, as a creator in the online space, what do you do? How do you stay engaged with this? Do you participate? What do you speak up about? If you're worried about cancel culture or offending someone or hurting someone's feelings, how can you take action?
Michelle Pualani: So let's go ahead and dive into those tactical approaches.
Joanna Newton: The first thing I always think about is it comes back to your personal brand and personal mission. Right? Like, this is work that you need to do when you're starting, when you're starting an account. And if you haven't done that, I know we have episodes in our podcast about thinking about your mission, your brand, when you're creating content. Because if you have a really strong sense of who you are, and right, there's a reality when you're online, there is a public image. And a private version of you, right? There is that. I have a small following and I choose [00:37:00] to show certain things publicly about myself and some things I don't show, right? Like there are some things that I don't. What don't I show, Michelle? You're laughing at me.
Michelle Pualani: You have been crushing it on social media. I have been loving your content. I think that you are showing up in an amazing way recently, and you were speaking on some hot button topics, and I think it's great because you have to decide what you're going to Write home about the hill that you're going to sacrifice yourself on, whatever that phrase is, you need to understand again, what's that important purpose mission.
Michelle Pualani: If you haven't yet go back, listen to our podcast on mission core values. It's so important for us to decide what's important and therefore that will dictate how we show up, our copy, our content creation, and what it is that we're willing to go to bat for when we speak out about these things.
Joanna Newton: So when one of these things, one of these issues comes up and you're like, should I, should I not come back to your core values? [00:38:00] Is this something that's important to me? Is this something that's important to my audience? What makes sense for me to talk about? Now, I'm not saying you can never talk about something. That is related to your core values, right? Like if maybe this has nothing to do, but you are passionate about it and want to include it, that's fine. But when you come to this moment where you're like, do I talk about it? Do I not coming back to that is going to give you the clarity that you need. That's going to help you make a decision.
Michelle Pualani: taking the time to reflect on this and deciding where you stand is important. So tuning into those core values, figuring out your mission, what's your purpose, what it is that aligns with how you're showing up. There are actually a lot of accounts that I follow and a lot of businesses who do not share anything about social injustice, political choices, anything of that nature.
Michelle Pualani: And they do it very intentionally. And I respect that because. I, [00:39:00] again, am not, as a consumer, going to put my pressure on someone who needs to say something in order to make me feel better. They've built that platform. They've built that following. They've built that audience for a specific reason. And I know their core values based on what they talk about.
Michelle Pualani: And if they're clearly sharing them, then that's great. through other types of content pieces, then that comes through. So I think it's important for you to decide where you stand on the issue and really research, understand it from multiple sides before you actually just come out and say anything. And then with that, I think that for each of us, we can speak up in a way that doesn't necessarily take sides.
Michelle Pualani: So, a lot of people are concerned about speaking out, usually on an issue, because what we have here is something that's a social injustice wrapped up into a political conversation. When I asked my husband about this, because history isn't really [00:40:00] my strong suit, nor is geography, he explained what is a Not just multi generational, but like hundreds if not thousands of year old issue.
Michelle Pualani: It is deeply entrenched in culture, in politics, in ways of being, in heritage that I know nothing about. Now, from again, an apology video perspective, if you're looking at something like Haley Bailey, I might not know nothing about that. However, I do know compassion and humanitarianism to the extent that I can say that killing people is wrong, especially for political or religious differences, especially civilians.
Michelle Pualani: Which is the huge point of distinction here in this conversation as you read more about it. It's not necessarily like army against army or military force against military force. It's about military force against civilians. So being thoughtful about, okay, if I am going to take a stand, if I do have [00:41:00] something to say about this, if it aligns with my core values and my mission, my brand, how I'm showing up, then I can take a stand that is reflective of that.
Michelle Pualani: Compassion, integrity, humanitarianism, as opposed to political alignment and being thoughtful about that.
Joanna Newton: this also is where actual connection and community with your audience also really, really helps. This is something that we've talked about on this podcast before, right? Showing up authentically to your audience, showing who you really are, sharing your life because a couple of things will happen. First, if you're authentic and you're engaging with your people. They're going to ask you what you think about the things that are important to them. So even if you've seen, there's a lot of celebrities who people have been saying, I want to know what you think about this. Now, it's still 100 percent their choice how they respond. But when you build a rapport with your people, they're going [00:42:00] to tell, they're going to talk to you. They're going to say like, you know what, Joanna, you know what? You haven't talked about this topic. I really want to know what you have to say. Those kinds of questions are going to help guide you if you actually connect with your people on what to say. Um, and also hopefully if you're building a personal brand. Right? You're being authentic. More likely than not, you are going to relate to your client avatar, right? Like your ideal client should oftentimes, especially if you're trying to build a personal brand, reflect parts of who you are, right? And so your audience should likely connect with your leanings. In that way, right? So they're going to talk to you. They're going to share with you. They'll likely tell you if it's off color and you can respond quickly too. You know what I mean? So building this rapport and [00:43:00] community with your people is so important because it's going to help this. It's going to help make sure that, you know, everything is, is aligned together.
Michelle Pualani: And if you're feeling like it's important to comment, but you're not necessarily sure on what to say, a really healthy way to do that is just engage people in conversation. So to take it a step further in creating that community, not necessarily to dictate even what you're going to say or how you're going to show up or what you're going to do, focus it on them.
Michelle Pualani: People have lots of opinions and a lot of times they want to be heard. So if you can cultivate and create a safe space in which they feel free to speak. speak up without feeling criticized or misunderstood or misjudged or not represented well, then that allows them to one, be more invested and trust you and respect the integrity that you bring to your business, but also allows them to get some weight off of their shoulders.
Michelle Pualani: Because I think when these things happen, when [00:44:00] these social phenomenons take over our feeds. And it's charged, and it's tied into, again, politics, emotion, injustice, social rights, we have a certain sense of confusion, we have this notion that we're alone or isolated and feeling the way that we do.
Michelle Pualani: So if you can bring people together and create and cultivate healthy discussion, it's also a unique opportunity for you to. speak up or speak out about it in a way that doesn't position you to be quote unquote cancelled or to take sides or to be slandered hopefully throughout that process. And then that being said, If you do choose to post about it, if you do choose to talk about it, you can decide if you want that to be public or private.
Michelle Pualani: So if you show up publicly in a place, you can speak your opinion, you can talk about what you want to talk about, you can share your thoughts on the matter. And you can also say, I know that this is [00:45:00] happening. On your public facing side of things. And I'm going to take this conversation to more private.
Michelle Pualani: So if you're interested in discussing that or hearing my opinions or thoughts, direct them to stories, direct them to the newsletter, direct them to a product or program in which they can engage with you in that way, because you also have to, at the end of the day, respect. and honor your boundaries and the integrity of what you are willing to put out into the world.
Michelle Pualani: So you can turn off the commenting. You can block people if they're being negative. You have the right to protect your home in the online space. No one's allowed to come into your home without your permission. So give yourself that right that if you think that for some reason what you say is going to cause some sort of, you know, Kerfluffle, for lack of a better word, and to attract that negativity or vitriol or conflicting opinions or people just being aggressively judgmental, you have the right to cut those people [00:46:00] out and be okay with that.
Michelle Pualani: So being in charge of your own narrative in the online space.
Joanna Newton: And there are definite. Pros and cons to aligning yourself either with the political side or with particular issues. And, uh, I'm going to talk about this from two perspectives. One, again, think we talked earlier, marketing science, scientific hat, figuring out how to hack the algorithms to get attention and get followers, right?
Joanna Newton: So you can get attention for your programs, your business, and those things. And then also the human side, right? Like the person who cares about issues. But if we're thinking from the marketing tactical hat for a second, aligning yourself With a particular political side can get you hate from one side, but can get you love from the other [00:47:00] side, right? So if you are aligning yourself with something and that something is really important to your audience, you can build a really quick rapport with them. understanding that you will build some really serious hatred from the side that disagrees with you. And that will happen. And you have to understand that is a possibility.
Joanna Newton: You know, when I, you know, you've been, you mentioned like the insanity that's been going on, on my social channels. It's coming from me speaking out about Um, issues women face in the workplace and in life in general, and some of the inequalities that are happening. Right? And, and one of the things that happens is men really like to tell me how wrong I am.
Joanna Newton: And what's really funny is they all like to tell me I'm just doing it for attention, while giving credit. Pay attention, like don't comment and this would not get as many views [00:48:00] like if it's that important, if you think that I'm a waste of space I mean sometimes people have told me that like I should die.
Joanna Newton: Do you know what I mean? Like this isn't it gets pretty Pretty intense and for the most part I can take it pretty Pretty sometimes it's just exhausting to read it all. But anyway when that happens You know, for me, when I know I'm not just doing it for attention, like I do things behind the scenes that people don't see that support women and help to decrease the gender, gender wage gap.
Joanna Newton: You know what I mean? Like I help women get promotions in their corporate jobs. I would be happy to share with them, like I won't because no one really cares. But if someone were to look at how I ping my team, you would see that I'm not people that are doing similar jobs, get the same pay, right? And it doesn't. It's not affected by their gender. You know, it's based on experience, the value that they bring and all of that. And [00:49:00] those are things I'm passionate about in my life. And as my business grows, we'll continue and I'll be able to have a bigger impact on those things as my business grows. So I'm doing things behind the scenes and in front of the scenes to do that. But when I talk about these things, I know what buttons I'm going to press. Right? And I'm aware of what certain things I say will Fire up certain people and I'm okay if those people don't like me, right? I've made that decision and know that that's possible that some people aren't going to like me and some people are going to love me more for sharing those opinions, right?
Joanna Newton: So there's, there's the like tactical attention, how to get attention, how to get comments, how to get shares that talking about tough issues can actually help you. You just have to be aware that you might get trolls, right? You might get haters. Someone might tell you that you should be lobotomized. Yesterday, someone [00:50:00] wished that I was homeless and on fentanyl. Like, like, I'm not even saying anything that bad about anybody. But like, the things people come up with is insane. But the point being that you have to be prepared for that and okay with that and decide whether that's right for you and your brand.
Joanna Newton: Right? And then the humanitarian side of me, you Also wants people to be able to express themselves, right? Like, you should, as a human, be doing something to help other humans. I don't actually care what it is, but as a human, you should be doing things that help other humans. You can do that publicly, you can do that privately.
Joanna Newton: That's like a, a your choice thing, but I want all humans to want a better life for all humans in the way that they're able to do that.
Michelle Pualani: Being okay with creating a personal brand that repels and attracts. I think that's something that I was super afraid of doing in the beginning and it made my [00:51:00] content really bland and boring. And I'm not saying just create triggering content, I'm not. CRS saying create. I'm not saying just create click bait.
Michelle Pualani: I'm not saying just latch onto any newsworthy thing and try to feed into it, but there is something to be said about being relevant. Trending content, paying attention, and being tapped in. There is this popular culture, entertainment, education, content creator economy that we've never had before. and so we're all evolving, growing, learning as we go, but as I step more into my own authentic voice, the ownership of my brand and my authority, the more I actually do want to speak about, up about these things, and the more that I.
Michelle Pualani: I'm inclined to take a stand or to have a say or at least contribute in some way because I think it's important and relevant and it's where our, again, our attention is. Attention is a currency. That's what money follows. Pay attention to that. And on the [00:52:00] conversation of money, if you are upset about these things, I want you to think about how you can make more money so that you can affect more change.
Michelle Pualani: Truthfully, at the end of the day, money is everything. Power. You can do things with money. You can leverage. You can leverage your attention. We're putting all this. Focus on Haley Bailey and having this platform and you should do these things. If you feel like you have things to say in the world, if you feel like you're a good, kind hearted, compassionate person, which I'm assuming you are because you're listening to this podcast, then you probably have amazing things that within you And you have amazing things within you that are ready to be presented to the world that need to get out there. And we need more people who are like you making more money. So if you can make more money, you can do more things. You can affect more change.
Michelle Pualani: You can donate to more organizations. You can just Give back in a way that you didn't even know was possible. So yes, there is this huge disparity of wealth that [00:53:00] we are seeing, but the way that I think about it now is, okay, great. How can I create a billion dollar company? Okay, great. How can I create the attention online to create this personal brand in which I do now have a platform in which I can speak out about in order to help people be more compassionate, to be more kind, to be more generous, to be more connected to themselves?
Michelle Pualani: Because so much of the world, which we will not get into the conversation of today, Joanna, when it comes to patriarchy and the way that things are run by men with the way that they view the world. That's a whole nother episode. Is that When good people who have good intention, who believe in humanity and who can actually take the action, make change, whether that's in government, whether that's through social movements, whether that's through nonprofits and organizations out there actually on the ground doing the [00:54:00] work, that's what we need to lift up.
Michelle Pualani: And I think that's where our time, our attention, our focus should go to.
Joanna Newton: Totally. So well said. Thank you for sharing that. Um, and I think that leads me to kind of my next piece of advice for creators is that we don't want as a creator to do what I'm gonna call post and ghost. So if you're going to talk about something, right, You can't only talk about it when it's hot and when it's trending. And if you're going to talk about something, you have to do something too. Whether that's with your money, whether that's with your attention, how you shop, places you give, volunteering. If you carry about, say, domestic violence against women, and only talk about it because there's a trending case going on [00:55:00] related to domestic violence against women, and you never talk about it again, and you don't do anything personally for that. That's not, one, again, tactical hat, that's not good for your brand, right? Because people will look at you and say, you only talk about this when it's trending. So tactical hat, that's bad for you. Humanitarian hat, also bad for you, right? Like, also bad for you as a person. If you're going to talk about something, you should do something about it, right?
Michelle Pualani: Absolutely, 1, 000%. And I think that that comes back to that mission. It's good to have a mission and a purpose. Like if you believe that your business and your platform is centered around something more important, you can pick that one thing. Pick that thing that you really care about. And lots of things tie into one another.
Michelle Pualani: So again, whether that's gender, whether that is, you know, sex, whether that's, you know, bodily rights, whether that is social, whether that is food, [00:56:00] whether that is fashion, whatever that thing is that you really care about as kind of like your underlying mission when it comes to the world and how you want to improve things, pick that one thing, tie into it, but absolutely stay consistent with it because that will only help and bolster your brand narrative overall.
Joanna Newton: so I hope those of you who have been listening today. have been inspired to, to think about your actions, your platform, how you could use it, and, and, how that should happen. I also want to encourage you, if we think back to the beginning of the conversation with us talking about celebrity, give your attention to the celebrities, the political leaders, the the companies that are doing good, right?
Joanna Newton: Give your attention there, elevate them, and do that. And I want to take a minute To elevate someone that I know is doing good with her platform. Um, I know someone, her name is [00:57:00] Dima. She writes children's books in Arabic and English to share stories from different generations. So, you know, as people immigrate, everyone can read the stories and it's really beautiful, beautiful work that she did. She is very passionate about. It's. the conflict in Palestine and the genocide essentially that's happening and the civilians, the families, the children that are being killed. And she got together with a group of folks to write a book called 48 Stories of Exile. And it's talking about people that have been exiled from, from Palestine and talking about what has happened historically in the world. So as we were talking about this, I was like, I know I want to give, I want to do something, and I made a purchase of this book that I'm going to read. Um, When appropriate, I'm going to educate my daughter [00:58:00] about what's happening in the world. And the really cool thing is that the proceeds from this book, um, you know, she shared that after shipping and, and costs and stuff, all of the money is going to the Palestine Children's Relief Fund.
Joanna Newton: So that money is going to a good place. We'll put the link to that book and to purchase that book in the show notes. Um, we encourage you to check it out. And if you feel so led, purchase a book and you'll be able to kind of put your money where your mouth is on this issue. Um, if this isn't the thing for you, I encourage you to just think today, who can you support, how can you, um, affect change, um, in your corner of the world and in your corner of influence.
Michelle Pualani: Beautifully shared. So as we start to close out today, Thinking back on some of the things that we've shared, you know, I know that these topics are controversial, I know that they're a lot of times uncomfortable, and I know that it's also hard to hear something different. [00:59:00] It's easy to jump on a bandwagon and say, yeah, we should do better, yeah, you should do better, yeah, I want you to be accountable, but um, but then I'm gonna go live my life and on a day by day basis never pay attention to anything of this nature again.
Michelle Pualani: And I think that's what a lot of us do. Because it's what we are comfortable doing and that's because maybe we are struggling with finances or maybe we're Like just focused on building our businesses and growing at the time of experiencing the social injustice and so it's tough to be able to Put your time and attention somewhere when you feel like there's this sense of either scarcity or lack or Survivalist attitude that's already happening kind of in your day to day life and we all live at different levels.
Michelle Pualani: And so just thoughtfully reflecting on how you want to take away some sort of tactical approach to apply in your business, on your platform, and in the way that you show up, or just as a human being, how can we shift and change as humans? [01:00:00] Because we're all humans. Ultimately we are humans as business owners, we are humans as influencers, content creators, we are humans as coaches, and we connect with humans.
Michelle Pualani: So if we can get back to that level and see ourselves and see others at that human level, how does that affect how we're acting, how we're being, and the way we're moving around the world?
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What is one thing you can do today to prioritize you in business and life?
